Economists praise "price discrimination" as "efficient." That's when a company charges customers different sums based on inferences about their willingness to pay. But when a firm sells you something for $2 that someone else can buy for $1, they're valuing the dollars in your pocket at half the rate of the other guy's.
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If you'd like an essay-formatted version of this to read or share, here's a link to it on pluralistic.net, my surveillance-free, ad-free blog:
pluralistic.net/2025/06/24/pri…
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
That's not how economists see it, of course. When a hotel sells you a room for $50 that someone else might get charged $500 for, that's efficient, *provided* that the hotelier is sure no $500 customers are likely to show up after you check in. The empty room makes them nothing, and $50 is more than nothing.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
There's a kind of metaphysics at work here, in which the room that is for sale at $500 is "a hotel room you book two weeks in advance and are sure will be waiting for you when you check in" while the $50 room is "a hotel room you can only get at the last minute, and if it's not available, you're sleeping in a chair at the Greyhound station."
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
But what if you show up at the hotel at 9pm and the hotelier can ask a credit bureau how much you can afford to pay for the room? What if they can find out that you're in chemotherapy, so you don't have the stamina to shop around for a cheaper room? What if they can tell that you have a 5AM flight and need to get to bed right now?
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
What if they charge you more because they can see that your kids are exhausted and cranky and the hotel infers that you'll pay more to get the kids tucked into bed? What if they charge you more because there's a wildfire and there are plenty of other people who want the room?
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
The metaphysics of "room you booked two weeks ago" as a different product from "room you're trying to book right now" break down pretty quickly once you factor in the ability of sellers to figure out how desperate you are - or merely how distracted you are - and charge accordingly.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
"Surveillance pricing" is the practice of spying on you to figure out how much you're willing to spend - because you're wealthy, because you're desperate, because you're distracted, because it's payday - and charging you more:
pluralistic.net/2024/06/05/you…
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Pluralistic: Surveillance pricing (05 Jun 2024) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow
pluralistic.netCory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
For example, a McDonald's ventures portfolio company called Plexure offers drive-through restaurants the ability to raise the price of your regular order based on whether you've recently received your paycheck. They're just one of many "personalized pricing" companies that have attracted investor capital to figure out how to charge you more for the things you need, or merely for the small pleasures of life.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
Personalized pricing (that is, "surveillance pricing") is part of the "pricing revolution" that is underway in the US and the world today. Another major element of this revolution are the "price clearinghouses" that charge firms within a sector to submit their prices to them, then "offer advice" on the optimum pricing. This advice - given to all the suppliers of a good or service - inevitably boils down to "everyone should raise their prices in unison."
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
So long as everyone follows that advice, we poor suckers have nowhere else to go to get a better deal.
This is a pretty thin pretext. Price-fixing is illegal, after all.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
These companies pretend that when all the meat-packers in America send their pricing data to a "neutral" body like Agri-Stats, which then tells them all to jack up the price of meat, that this isn't a price-fixing conspiracy, since the actual conspiracy takes the form of strongly worded suggestions from an entity that isn't formally part of the industry:
pluralistic.net/2023/10/04/don…
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Pluralistic: For 40 years, Big Meat has openly colluded to rig prices (04 Oct 2023) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow
pluralistic.netCory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
Same goes for when all the landlords in town send their rental data to a company like Realpage, which then offers "advice" about the optimum price, along with stern warnings not to rent below that price: apparently *that's* not price-fixing either:
popular.info/p/feds-raid-corpo…
It's not just sellers who engage in this kind of price-fixing - it's also *buyers*. Specifically buyers of labor, AKA "bosses."
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Feds raid corporate landlord, escalating nationwide criminal probe of rent increases
Judd Legum (Popular Information)Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
Take contract nursing, where a cartel of three staffing apps have displaced the many small regional staffing agencies that historically served the sector. These companies buy nurses' credit history from the unregulated, Wild West data-brokerage sector.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
They're checking to see whether a nurse who's looking for a shift has a lot of credit-card debt, especially delinquent debt, because these nurses are facing economic hardship and will accept a lower wage than their better-off compatriots:
pluralistic.net/2024/12/18/loo…
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Pluralistic: Nurses whose shitty boss is a shitty app (17 Dec 2024) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow
pluralistic.netCory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
This is surveillance pricing for *buyers*, and as with the sell-side pricing revolution, buyers also make use of a third party as an accountability sink (a term coined by Dan Davies): the apps that they use to buy nursing labor are a convenient way for hospitals to pretend that they're not engaged in price-fixing for labor.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
Veena Dubal calls this "algorithmic wage discrimination." Algorithmic wage discrimination doesn't need to use third-party surveillance data: Uber, who invented the tactic, use their own in-house data as a way to make inferences about drivers' desperation and thus their willingness to accept a lower wage. Drivers who are less picky about which rides they accept are treated as more desperate, and offered lower wages than their pickier colleagues:
pluralistic.net/2023/04/12/alg…
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Pluralistic: Gig apps trap reverse centaurs in wage-stealing Skinner boxes (12 Apr 2023) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow
pluralistic.netCory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
But this gets much creepier and more powerful when combined with aggregated surveillance data.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
This is one of the real labor consequences of AI: not the hypothetical millions of people who will become technologically unemployed, numbers that AI bosses pull out of their asses and hand to dutiful stenographers in the tech press who help them extol the power of their products; but rather the millions of people whose wages are suppressed by algorithms that continuously recalculate how desperate a worker is apt to be and lower their wages accordingly.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
This is as good a candidate for AI regulation as any, but it's also a *very* good reason to regulate data brokers, who operate with total impunity. Thankfully, Biden's Consumer Finance Protection Bureau passed a rule that made data brokers effectively illegal:
pluralistic.net/2024/06/10/get…
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Pluralistic: The CFPB is genuinely making America better, and they’re going HARD (10 Jun 2024) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow
pluralistic.netCory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
But then Trump got elected and his despicable minions killed that rule, giving data brokers carte blanche to spy on you and sell your data, effectively without restriction:
wired.com/story/cfpb-quietly-k…
(womp-womp)
Also, Biden's FTC was in the middle of an antitrust investigation into surveillance pricing on the eve of the election, a prelude to banning the practice in America:
pluralistic.net/2024/07/24/gou…
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Pluralistic: FTC vs surveillance pricing (24 Jul 2024) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow
pluralistic.netCory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
But then Trump got elected and his despicable minions killed that investigation and instead created a snitch line where FTC employees could complain about colleagues who were "woke":
ftc.gov/system/files/ftc_gov/p…
(Womp.)
(Womp.)
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
Naomi Klein's *Doppelganger* proposes a "mirror world" that the fever-swamp right lives in - a world where concern for kids takes the form of Pizzagate conspiracies, while ignoring the starving babies in Gaza and the kids whose parents are being kidnapped by ICE:
pluralistic.net/2023/09/05/not…
The pricing revolution is a kind of mirror-world Marxism, grounded in "From each according to their ability to pay; to each according to their economic desperation":
pluralistic.net/2025/01/11/soc…
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Pluralistic: Naomi Klein’s “Doppelganger” (05 September 2023) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow
pluralistic.netCory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
A recent episode of the excellent Organized Money podcast featured an interview with Lee Hepner, an antitrust lawyer who is on the front lines of the pricing revolution (on the side of workers and buyers) (not bosses):
organizedmoney.fm/p/the-wild-w…
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The Wild World of Surveillance Pricing with Lee Hepner
David Dayen (Organized Money)Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
Hepner is the one who proposed the formulation that personalized pricing is a way for corporations to decide that your dollars are worth less than your neighbors' dollars - a form of economic discrimination that treats the poorest, most desperate, and most precarious among us as the people who should pay the most, because we are the people whose dollars are worth the least.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
Now, this isn't always true. Earlier this month, the Delta, United and American were caught charging more for single travelers than they charged pairs of groups:
thriftytraveler.com/news/airli…
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Exclusive: US Airlines Are Quietly Hitting Solo & Biz Travelers with Higher Fares
Kyle Potter (Thrifty Traveler)Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
That's a way to charge business travelers extra - for valuing their dollars less than the dollars of families, not because business travelers are desperate, but because they are, on average, richer than holidaymakers (because their bosses are presumed to be buying their tickets). Sometimes, price discrimination really *does* charge richer people more to subsidize everyone else.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
But here's the difference: when the news about the business-traveler's premium broke, its victims - powerful people with social capital and also regular capital - rose up in outrage, and the airlines reversed the policy:
thriftytraveler.com/news/airli…
If the airlines are still pursuing this kind of price discrimination, they'll do something sneakier, like buying our credit histories before showing us a price.
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After Blowback, Delta & United Dump Fares That Punish Solo Travelers
Kyle Potter (Thrifty Traveler)Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
This is something British Airways is already teeing up, offering essentially *zero* reward miles to frequent fliers for partner airline tickets unless they're purchased from BA's own website:
onemileatatime.com/news/the-br…
But BA operates in the UK, where most of the pre-Brexit, EU-based privacy regime is still intact, despite the best efforts of Kier Starmer to destroy it, something that neither Boris Johnson, nor Theresa May, nor Liz Truss could manage:
openrightsgroup.org/press-rele…
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The British Airways Club: BA Massively Overhauls Loyalty Program
Ben Schlappig (One Mile at a Time)Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
So for now, BA travleers might be safe from surveillance pricing, at least in the UK and EU. And that's the thing, America is pretty much cooked. It might be generations - centuries - before the USA emerges from its Trumpian decline and becomes a civilized democracy again. Americans have little hope of a future in which their government protects them from corporate predators, rather than serving them up on a toothpick, along with a little cocktail napkin.
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Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
The future of the fight against corporate power and oligarchy is something for the rest of the world to carry on, as the American hermit kingdom sinks into ever-deeper collapse:
pluralistic.net/2025/06/21/bil…
And as it happens, Canada's Competition Bureau, newly equipped with muscular enforcement powers thanks to a 2024 law, is seeking public comment on surveillance pricing and whether Canada should do something about it:
canada.ca/en/competition-burea…
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Competition Bureau seeks feedback on algorithmic pricing and competition - Canada.ca
www.canada.caCory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
I'm writing comments for this one. If you're in Canada, or a Canadian abroad (like me), perhaps you could, too. If you're looking for an excellent Canadian perspective to crib from, check out this episode of *The Globe and Mail's* Lately podcast on the subject:
theglobeandmail.com/podcasts/l…
Just because America jumped off the Empire State Building, that's no reason for Canada to jump off the CN Tower, after all.
(Eh?)
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The end of the fixed price
The Lately staff (The Globe and Mail)Cory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
I'm at the end of my 24-city book tour for my new novel *Picks and Shovels*!
Catch me in #LONDON with RILEY QUINN from #TRASHFUTURE on July 1:
howtoacademy.com/events/cory-d…
And in #MANCHESTER at Blackwell's Bookshop on July 2:
eventbrite.co.uk/e/an-evening-…
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An Evening With Cory Doctorow
EventbriteCory Doctorow
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
Image:
Cryteria (modified)
commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fil…
CC BY 3.0
creativecommons.org/licenses/b…
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File:HAL9000.svg - Wikimedia Commons
commons.wikimedia.orgscurvy_duck
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Cory Doctorow
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scurvy_duck
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Opus
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
Cory Doctorow reshared this.
Das
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
Andrew Orr
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Sensitive content
“When a hotel sells you a room for $50 that someone else might get charged $500 for, that's efficient, *provided* that the hotelier is sure no $500 customers are likely to show up after you check in.”
Schroedinger’s Asshole
Cory Doctorow reshared this.
EndicottRoad59
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Cory Doctorow reshared this.
Bodhipaksa
in reply to EndicottRoad59 • • •Siobhan
in reply to Bodhipaksa • • •C++ Wage Slave
in reply to Siobhan • • •@siobhan @bodhipaksa @EndicottAuthor
The big UK supermarkets have used personal pricing for years. But they don't call it that: they call it "offers chosen for you." Anyone who doesn't opt into the loyalty scheme pays full price for everything.
About the only defence a customer has is to carry a physical loyalty card rather than installing the store's creepy app. Unsurprisingly, when you apply for the card, stores push you really hard to install the app instead, and, for at least one store (Marks and Spencer), it's the app or nothing. The app, of course, needs an outrageous set of permissions and contains no fewer than ten trackers:
reports.exodus-privacy.eu.org/…
Bodhipaksa
in reply to C++ Wage Slave • • •@CppGuy @siobhan @EndicottAuthor That's different, though. If you have a loyalty card you know the price of an item, and you know what the discount will be. Anyone with a loyalty card will get that discount.
What some supermarkets in the US seem to be talking about is tracking people with facial ID and combining that with data from data brokers in order to gauge how much to charge you. Buying tampons and you're on your period? Price goes up, b/c they know you really need them now.
C++ Wage Slave
in reply to Bodhipaksa • • •@bodhipaksa
I understand the distinction, but the UK is already closer than that to personalised pricing. Some discounts are available to everyone with a loyalty card, but others, offered online, are personalised. Tesco seems to use them to tempt me to buy
Sainsbury has a big sign, touting personalised offers, at the entrance to our nearest branch. And the checkout usually prints vouchers of the form "spend twice as much as usual within a week and get £15 off the bill".
@siobhan @pluralistic @EndicottAuthor
Christopher
in reply to C++ Wage Slave • • •@CppGuy @siobhan @bodhipaksa @EndicottAuthor
In the case of Tesco, the biggest loyalty card pushers, it's not discounted price and real price. It's real price and profiteering price. This was obvious when they rolled out this in a big way, a few years ago, where in my local Tesco Express I saw price increases of 50% and above in the "non-loyalty" prices, almost overnight. It worked, I got a card. (That shop is trivial walking distance, anything better is a bus ride.)
Except Jaffa cakes. Pricing there is nuts. Always check all sizes for which is cheaper today. But don't buy any size unless at least one has an offer. And if you can afford it, if something you want but not need does not have an offer, wait until it does.
Todd Knarr
in reply to Siobhan • • •HighlandLawyer
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Cluster Fcku
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Cory Doctorow reshared this.
Simon Brooke
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Cory Doctorow reshared this.
Marco
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •remember this one?
“We've never tested and we never will test prices based on customer demographics,” said Amazon.com founder and CEO Jeff Bezos.
(After testing randomly varying prices on customers)
press.aboutamazon.com/2000/9/a…
Amazon.com Issues Statement Regarding Random Price Testing
US Press CenterCory Doctorow reshared this.
Chris Brand
in reply to Marco • • •Marco
in reply to Chris Brand • • •Viral Obscurity
in reply to Marco • • •I've seen the same effect on a singular Amazon prime account when viewing from the app on android and brave on Linux (reports as chrome windows)
The app price was more expensive for the exact same item and didn't show all of the colour options which varied in price
I compared this with a family member with a prime account on Firefox Mac and they had higher prices still
The prices are totally manipulated based on device profiling
Hoggrim 🐗
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •maya_b 🇨🇦
Unknown parent • • •@jackwilliambell @simon_brooke
with the "first rule of business" typically being a variation of "never leave money on the table" means any seller will try to maximize profits, regardless of who they're selling to, or at what price point.
there are are also pricing strategies to drive consumers to "pick" a desired option. eg 3 similar things for sale: one cheap in all regards, one overpriced, and one "Goldilocks" in between option that has the best profit margin of them all.
sleepy62🍁🛠️ 🖥️ 🔬 🌞
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •My eldest sister had the cheapest quote so she ordered it.
Cory Doctorow reshared this.
Mark Corbett Wilson
in reply to sleepy62🍁🛠️ 🖥️ 🔬 🌞 • • •This reverses the Quaker principle of "one price to all" and raises questions about fairness and transparency that echo the original concerns Quakers had about haggling - different people paying different prices for identical goods, often without their knowledge.
pseyfert
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •LeoWandersleb
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Clearly Amazon knows who would pay more than others and clearly it is in their interest to charge accordingly. They control the market and when you can control the market, you can extract more profits from it than an efficient market would allow any trader to extract.
For the producer and the buyer, an efficient market would be the best as then, the middle man would extract the least.
Jack William Bell
Unknown parent • • •@dnkboston @simon_brooke
> "… a lot of people don't have options, and the people who run them know that."
I suspect it's more complicated than that. If you only have a dollar you don't have an option – unless you don't actually NEED the good on hand, in which case you have the option of not buying cosmetics or a stickerbook or whatever.
And yet people with little money buy those things. I'm not condemning them, but I am saying there are no simple answers for complex problems.
Deb Nam-Krane
Unknown parent • • •@jackwilliambell The not-poor can afford a better value because they're not poor.
When Jack Monroe created the index, they were writing as they were going in and out of poverty. Other poor people knew they were being hustled but literally couldn't afford to do anything about it.
Dollar stores don't exist because people are thinking they can get a better value. They exist because a lot of people don't have options, and the people who run them know that.
@simon_brooke @pluralistic
Jack William Bell
Unknown parent • • •@dnkboston @simon_brooke
Yup. See, "… there are a lot of people who do not properly differentiate between 'price' and 'value'."
If everyone was good at determining actual value dollar stores would not exist and 'reducing the size of government' would be a process of determining cost-benefit ratios.
Deb Nam-Krane
Unknown parent • • •FElon&Felon47🇺🇦🇨🇦🇩🇰🇹🇼
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Oh shit, haggling + AI = pure hell.
The (old) American tradition (which is also a legal one versus more powerful near-monopoly firms) of public pricing for all customers is a boon to market efficiency! It reduces exploitation of market power against the commonwealth.
tasket
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •I know this is due to a limitation in Mastodon, but please consider not posting entire articles in small pieces on fedi. A summary (even in 2 or 3 parts) with a link to your blog would suffice. Or you could put the entire thing in one post.
That way my TL would not get that "overrun with replies" look if I followed you. (I used to follow you...)
@Gargron #mastodon
Cory Doctorow
in reply to tasket • • •@tasket @Gargron s
See pluralistic.net/2023/04/16/how… in which I explain my choice of servers, etc, as well as how to filter threads in your timeline.
My threads are CC BY, and available in fulltext RSS. You can remix that feed however you'd like including publishing it on Fediverse in a format you prefer.
I publish in multiple formats and you are more than welcome to unfollow here and get them some other way.
As my bio notes, 'I post long threads.'
How To Make the Least-Worst Mastodon Threads – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow
pluralistic.nettasket
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •@Gargron Thanks, but I decided to switch to using RSS for your feed. The issue is that I still want to see "Long threads" emerge in my TL, but only the first 1 or 2 parts.
Mastodon has remained assiduously non-algorithmic in its TL presentation. So in rejecting complex, blackbox algorithms it also rejects ones that could be less than 4 lines of open code yet very beneficial to the users' pursuit of "effective communication" to use Eugen's term.
Robert Kingett
in reply to tasket • • •Cory Doctorow
in reply to Robert Kingett • • •@WeirdWriter @tasket @Gargron
No, it's entirely manual, it is very labor intensive, and it is deliberate. It may not be right for you, and that is fine, and that is why I make the same text available in so many formats, so you can choose one that works better for you.
Robert Kingett
in reply to Cory Doctorow • • •Pluralistic: Surveillance pricing lets corporations decide what your dollar is worth (24 Jun 2025) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow
pluralistic.net